5 star tuning 1.5L dyno sheet

[Mark S.]

It is definitely faster than our Passport which is a 280hp V6 but it has 4200 pounds to haul around.

Acceleration can be affected by many factors, with power-to-weight ratio one of them. 280 hp at 4,200 lbs is 15 lbs per horsepower. The Bronco Sport is 3,700 lbs, so to match the Passport's power-to-weight ratio your engine needs to produce a bit over 245 hp, which is nearly 30% more than stock.

To be sure you would have to do some acceleration comparisons between the two vehicles, but if your Bronco Sport is significantly faster than your Passport your engine must be producing significantly more power than stock.

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[Meanderthal]

Acceleration can be affected by many factors, with power-to-weight ratio one of them. 280 hp at 4,200 lbs is 15 lbs per horsepower. The Bronco Sport is 3,700 lbs, so to match the Passport's power-to-weight ratio your engine needs to produce a bit over 245 hp, which is nearly 30% more than stock.

To be sure you would have to do some acceleration comparisons between the two vehicles, but if your Bronco Sport is significantly faster than your Passport your engine must be producing significantly more power than stock.

I would think that in this case, and any case, comparing acceleration of one vehicle to another by looking at peak HP and TQ numbers is clearly the wrong way of doing it. It is more accurate to look at the curve of HP and TQ. I would expect the V6 to have a pretty strong low end torque curve but a 4-cyl turbo can have a very strong low end torque curve as well, depending on how it is tuned.

The point is that peak numbers have nothing to do with the "feel" of acceleration from one vehicle to another. Maybe not nothing, but you know what I mean.

 

[Mark S.]

The point is that peak numbers have nothing to do with the "feel" of acceleration from one vehicle to another. Maybe not nothing, but you know what I mean.

Certainly! It depends on what you're comparing. If you're talking about day-to-day driveability--how does the car accelerate using typical throttle inputs in traffic--I agree. If you're talking about pure acceleration--what is the best 0-60 and quarter-mile times--power-to-weight ratio is the best predictor. You can make a vehicle "feel" quicker by simply increasing throttle response, but that does nothing to improve maximum pedal-to-the-metal acceleration.

My post was predicated on the assumption Shawn was talking about peak acceleration. He installed modified software to get the most power out of his engine, which suggested to me he's referring to maximum acceleration when he said his BS is "quicker" than his Passport. This is why I added the caveat at the end that he would have to perform actual acceleration tests to be sure.

 

[WinTech]

Acceleration can be affected by many factors, with power-to-weight ratio one of them. 280 hp at 4,200 lbs is 15 lbs per horsepower. The Bronco Sport is 3,700 lbs, so to match the Passport's power-to-weight ratio your engine needs to produce a bit over 245 hp, which is nearly 30% more than stock.

To be sure you would have to do some acceleration comparisons between the two vehicles, but if your Bronco Sport is significantly faster than your Passport your engine must be producing significantly more power than stock.

Big bend is listed as 3467lbs (badlands is 3700) so if the dyno sheet is right my BS is probably producing maybe 220hp (just a guess since the 93 tune was 230hp) which is just about 15lbs/hp. However, it is likely the low end torque that makes a difference here. Again if the dyno sheet is right my 1.5 is making almost as much torque as the Passport (93 octane was +60lb/ft at the wheels). Add in probably lower gearing in the first few gears and off the line it is faster. The transmission in the BS is much more responsive than the one in the passport so that may make a difference.

 

[WinTech]

Certainly! It depends on what you're comparing. If you're talking about day-to-day driveability--how does the car accelerate using typical throttle inputs in traffic--I agree. If you're talking about pure acceleration--what is the best 0-60 and quarter-mile times--power-to-weight ratio is the best predictor. You can make a vehicle "feel" quicker by simply increasing throttle response, but that does nothing to improve maximum pedal-to-the-metal acceleration.

My post was predicated on the assumption Shawn was talking about peak acceleration. He installed modified software to get the most power out of his engine, which suggested to me he's referring to maximum acceleration when he said his BS is "quicker" than his Passport. This is why I added the caveat at the end that he would have to perform actual acceleration tests to be sure.

Maybe it is just the butt-o-meter, but away from a stoplight the BS feels quicker to get going and more responsive. I don't drive the passport every day but did most of the driving on a 3000 mile road trip this summer. When we got back the BS felt super quick compared to the passport. It is smaller and lighter and the tune likely includes changes to the throttle response and the way the transmission behaves. It took me a minute to not speed away from a stop because it is way more responsive. The Passport takes more pedal input to scoot away from a stop than the BS does.

 

[WinTech]

how does the tune work with goat modes. Do you still have them has options to use after loading a tune?

I have only tried the sport mode and other than the normal higher rpms in a given gear it doesn't make as much difference from normal mode as it did before the tune. For this reason I just keep it in normal mode because it just doesn't feel like it needs any extra.

 

[Mark S.]

Again if the dyno sheet is right my 1.5 is making almost as much torque as the Passport (93 octane was +60lb/ft at the wheels). Add in probably lower gearing in the first few gears and off the line it is faster. The transmission in the BS is much more responsive than the one in the passport so that may make a difference.

These are all "driveability" characteristics. Low-end torque is one of the primary benefits of Ford's implementation of turbocharging. The ultra low-mass blades in the 1.5L turbocharger are designed to spin up rapidly, resulting in an almost flat torque curve.

But as you note, low-end torque is what gets you off the line quickly. It also makes the car "feel" zippier, which is why Ford (and other manufacturers) have been successful in convincing their customers to give up V6 engines. If done right, you can get the same or better drivability with a turbocharged 4-cyl as with a V6. But for sustained acceleration--the best 0-60 and quarter-mile time--you need horsepower, and that means maintaining all that low-end torque to a higher RPM. That's where Ford's small-displacement turbocharged engines are lacking. Ford's tuning generally tapers boost as RPM increases, mainly to control heat. Most of the vendors of modified PCM software (a tune) take advantage of that by maintaining boost pressures to higher RPMs, which increases horsepower.

To get a valid comparison between your Passport and your BS as regards power-to-weight ratio you would either need to put them both on a dynamometer, or do some full-power acceleration testing.

 

[charosenz]

I emailed 5 star about tunes for my SCT BDX tuner to use on my BS and they emailed me this dyno sheet. Very impressive. Stock is about 150hp and 195lb ft to the wheels and the 93 octane is 205hp and about 260lb ft. That is incredibly impressive. Even the 87 tune gave gains of about 25hp and 30lb ft. I'll be ordering a few tunes including the 93 in the near future and I will report back here with my impressions.

I dont suppose they shared with you how much boost they added to this tune did they?

 

[WinTech]

I dont suppose they shared with you how much boost they added to this tune did they?

Nope, no details as to what the parameters are with each tune. I don't even know what the stock psi of the turbo in this vehicle is. I had a 1.5T civic for a while that I also tuned. It had similar horsepower to this engine and was 16.5 psi stock and the stage 2 tune for 92 octane that I ran was 21psi. Made a huge difference.

 

[charosenz]

Nope, no details as to what the parameters are with each tune. I don't even know what the stock psi of the turbo in this vehicle is. I had a 1.5T civic for a while that I also tuned. It had similar horsepower to this engine and was 16.5 psi stock and the stage 2 tune for 92 octane that I ran was 21psi. Made a huge difference.

I emailed 5 Star and asked if they would share a graph with the Boost Pressure (MAP) and here was their reply........... "I do not have an exact graph showing the boost differences, there are many different variables that affect how much boost these things will run. We do allow them to run a few more pounds of boost over factory, but there are many other things that play into how we make power with with these, boost is honestly a very small variable in comparison to other changes. "

I can't say I blame them for not wanting to share this, but it does make me wonder how much Boost is being used.

But I also have not problem believing the graph is accurate. It is very doable if you really want to push the engine that hard, it certainly can be done.....

Charlie

 

[Mark S.]

"...but there are many other things that play into how we make power with with these, boost is honestly a very small variable in comparison to other changes."

The reason they aren't sharing the data is because they don't want to scare away potential customers. The powertrain control module (PCM) is really just a software program that manages engine functions. It has full control over fuel injection, ignition timing, turbo boost, wastegate, bypass valve, etc. It uses input from the many sensors—including the throttle pedal position—to determine exactly how much fuel to inject, how much boost, where to set timing, etc. The software sets safety limits on all of these factors based on sensor indications. If temps are too high, cut power output; if the knock sensor trips cut power output; etc. Thus, the way to get more power is obvious: reduce and/or eliminate the safety limits built in to the engine control software. This is the primary reason vendors who sell these software power upgrades require the use of 91 octane or higher fuel. They know the engine will not long survive the many detonation events sure to occur using their software.

 

[SgtT11B]

The issue with a lot of these tunes is heat soak will rear its ugly head quite a bit sooner. As you run up the boost you start to overload the already inadequate intercoolers already on the car. I wish Ford would come out with one for the BS as they did for the Ranger and Bronco. Its only worth about 20-30rwhp but a ton of low end and midrange. More importantly they firm up the shifting strategies over the factory tranny tuning. I had a Livernois tune on my 2017 Ford Escape Titanium, yes it added power, but the way the transmission shifted and acted was the major improvement for me than the horsepower.

The 5 star tuning unfortunately doesn't have CARB approval. I realize you can switch back to the OEM tune before smogging. 5Star tuning is in S. Carolina, sooner or later the EPA will come knocking on their door like they have with other large tuning shops. They need to start offering at least 49 state approval, but even better get a CARB EO# so it will be 50 state legal.

 

[Blue oval fan]

I would jump all over this but don't want to hassle with getting engine warranty coverage. From what I heard dealers can tell when a rewrite has been performed on an ECU. The ECU keeps track of Lots of the Focus ST/RS guys got flagged for tunes. That additional torque is tempting though.

 

[WinTech]

I emailed 5 Star and asked if they would share a graph with the Boost Pressure (MAP) and here was their reply........... "I do not have an exact graph showing the boost differences, there are many different variables that affect how much boost these things will run. We do allow them to run a few more pounds of boost over factory, but there are many other things that play into how we make power with with these, boost is honestly a very small variable in comparison to other changes. "

I can't say I blame them for not wanting to share this, but it does make me wonder how much Boost is being used.

But I also have not problem believing the graph is accurate. It is very doable if you really want to push the engine that hard, it certainly can be done.....

Charlie

Given the power gains shown in the dyno sheet I imagine it is similar to the Honda since the power gains were similar. They have been doing this a long time so they know what is safe and manufacturers are crazy conservative on their tunes. For example, there are guys getting 260hp on otherwise stock Civic Si's with just a tune. They are capable of even more with a bigger turbo on stock internals. It is the stock clutch that can't handle it though. I mean if Toyota can get 300hp out of a 1.6L 3 cylinder, I think 220hp or so out of the BS motor is pretty good

 

[charosenz]

Given the power gains shown in the dyno sheet I imagine it is similar to the Honda since the power gains were similar. They have been doing this a long time so they know what is safe and manufacturers are crazy conservative on their tunes. For example, there are guys getting 260hp on otherwise stock Civic Si's with just a tune. They are capable of even more with a bigger turbo on stock internals. It is the stock clutch that can't handle it though. I mean if Toyota can get 300hp out of a 1.6L 3 cylinder, I think 220hp or so out of the BS motor is pretty good

Brady from 5 Start did follow up and offered this bit of info..
"On 87 octane you will see 18-20psi and on 93 you will see 20-22psi."

So, yes, it was pretty much close to what you susupected. I do agree that there is a lot more to just adding boost to make all this happen.

Charlie

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