Recall Work Failed

[magicbus]

I was scheduled for the recall update but just cancelled it. Three years , original battery, only 11K miles, and no issues except the auto stop/start doesn't work, which I am happy about. I decided not to mess with it until something gives me a reason to.

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[sajohnson]

I was scheduled for the recall update but just cancelled it. Three years , original battery, only 11K miles, and no issues except the auto stop/start doesn't work, which I am happy about. I decided not to mess with it until something gives me a reason to.

A reasonable decision.

We're in the same boat.-- about 2-1/2 years old, original battery (tested good at dealer); about 6k miles.

My thinking was that a)Ford does not want to make any more work for itself, so if there were any issues they'd pause the recall (as with Gen. 1)and b) at this point enough recall recalibrations have been done that if it was causing a problem(s) we'd know about it.

Of course it's possible that a problem may not show up in the first couple months....

"If it works don't fix it" is usually a good philosophy.

 

[Dude]

A reasonable decision.

We're in the same boat.-- about 2-1/2 years old, original battery (tested good at dealer); about 6k miles.

My thinking was that a)Ford does not want to make any more work for itself, so if there were any issues they'd pause the recall (as with Gen. 1)and b) at this point enough recall recalibrations have been done that if it was causing a problem(s) we'd know about it.

Of course it's possible that a problem may not show up in the first couple months....

"If it works don't fix it" is usually a good philosophy.

Recall definitely caused problems for some owners which a subset of those are safety problems that the recall was designed to fix.

However … Recall 24S24 does not state the recall has fixed the issue. Reading the description literally indicates to me that the recall provides an improved detection of 12V battery SOC.

And everything else in the recall fix depends on an accurate 12V battery SOC however the recall states the SOC detection is “improved”.

See Post #55 earlier for the recall wording.

I had the recall done and I continue to disable auto start/stop and I continue to drive often enough to keep the battery charged. I noticed my voltage readout (plugged into 12V port) shows over 14V more than prior to the recall - because one of the recall’s fixes runs the alternator output more, I can see that is occurring.

You use the battery maintainer which is still needed in my opinion for those that do not drive often enough and for long enough time at >30 mph.

 

[João Leme]

You use the battery maintainer which is still needed in my opinion for those that do not drive often enough and for long enough time at >30 mph.

What would be a safe use of the BS in daily routine without the need of a battery maintener? What is this minimum of driving time and should It be at least at >30 mph?

 

[Dude]

What would be a safe use of the BS in daily routine without the need of a battery maintener? What is this minimum of driving time and should It be at least at >30 mph?

I’ve posted this: drive at least 30 minutes for at least 30mph (so not stop and go driving)

But others recommend different amount of time like 20 minutes at >= 30mph

(This does not apply if a vehicle has a phantom current drain that is substantially higher than typical average for Bronco Sports.
Bronco Sports wake up periodically to do “work” even when the engine is not running plus all the current just to power vehicle electronics that take power even when the vehicle is off)

 

[sajohnson]

Recall definitely caused problems for some owners which a subset of those are safety problems that the recall was designed to fix.

However … Recall 24S24 does not state the recall has fixed the issue. Reading the description literally indicates to me that the recall provides an improved detection of 12V battery SOC.

And everything else in the recall fix depends on an accurate 12V battery SOC however the recall states the SOC detection is “improved”.

See Post #55 earlier for the recall wording.

I had the recall done and I continue to disable auto start/stop and I continue to drive often enough to keep the battery charged. I noticed my voltage readout (plugged into 12V port) shows over 14V more than prior to the recall - because one of the recall’s fixes runs the alternator output more, I can see that is occurring.

You use the battery maintainer which is still needed in my opinion for those that do not drive often enough and for long enough time at >30 mph.

La-la-la-la-la....the recall is perfect in every way -- all of our problems have vanished!

As I mentioned above, I was on the fence about the recall. I've been monitoring the battery voltage (using a Fluke 179) and it has been consistently fine (even after short trips, or moving wood around on our property), so I was not surprised that it tested good at the dealership. As far as I can tell, the charging system was/is working fine.

I've read about the problems BS owners have had after getting the recalibration done. At this point, I'd say the jury is still out. There are a few possibilities, including:

1) The recall IS causing problems -- but then why only with some vehicles?
2) The fact that the recall is necessary means at least some SUVs already had dying batteries.
3) Of course correlation does not equal causation. It's tempting to attribute problems that happen after the recall work to the recalibration. The recall *could* be the cause, but not necessarily.
4) Very few people will post, "I had the recall done and have no problems!" Some do of course, but it's human nature to be more prone to mention failures.

Good point about the recall language. Words like "improved" do not fill one with confidence. My expectation/hope is that at a minimum it will not negatively affect the performance of the charging system. Based on my initial measurement (which is obviously far from conclusive) it is working the same or better. 3 hours after my wife got home form the dealership, which is only about 6 miles away, the (original, 2-1/2 year old) battery measured 12.71V (I'd seen mostly 16.6V +/- 0.02V previously).

I have now built a Battery Tender (BT) SHRINE in my house! All hail the wonderous BT!

Seriously, I've stopped connecting the BT 100% of the time -- in part because I want to see what happens with the voltage without it. Voltage drop has been minimal. If it's over ~12.6V I don't use the BT. If it's just a couple days between trips, it's fine. If I see it drop below about 12.58 I'll connect the BT -- in which case the 3 amp BT indicates it's fully charged within about 15-20 minutes.

I may revise that if the recalibrated charging system charges it to ~12.7V. In the past, I'd always read that 12.7 was a full charge (dep. on temp) but more recently I've heard 12.6 -- and many charts indicate 12.6. Still, if the new resting voltage is around 12.7 I may connect the BT at (say) <12.65V.

 

[sajohnson]

I’ve posted this: drive at least 30 minutes for at least 30mph (so not stop and go driving)

But others recommend different amount of time like 20 minutes at >= 30mph

(This does not apply if a vehicle has a phantom current drain that is substantially higher than typical average for Bronco Sports.
Bronco Sports wake up periodically to do “work” even when the engine is not running plus all the current just to power vehicle electronics that take power even when the vehicle is off)

Ideally people would check the "resting" battery voltage to determine whether a battery maintainer is needed.

Of course, not everyone will do that, so guidelines like yours are useful.

In our experience, even short (6 miles one-way) trips to the grocery store or dealer do not discharge the battery. It's ~12.6V before leaving the house and it's 12..6+ after returning and sitting/resting for a few hours.

The other day, we moved more wood around the property with the trailer. That involved a lot of idling with the A/C on; very slow (<3 mph) driving, and stopping and starting the engine a few times. Result? No change in battery voltage (12.2V before/after).

EDIT: 12.62V before/after (not 12.2)

Of course, our experience may be atypical,

 

[João Leme]

Following here as info for you regarding my BS. BS 2023 with recall made in may. After that it had some start stop failure multiple times, battery with 1 year and some months old. They exchanged the battery today in the dealer but even after that the auto start stop failure appeared again with a new battery assembled. My BS 2023 has only 9200 miles, it is in ford dealer right now under investigation of what would be the issue... I dont know what could it be, maybe the starter... lets wait pray and see...

 

[sajohnson]

Following here as info for you regarding my BS. BS 2023 with recall made in may. After that it had some start stop failure multiple times, battery with 1 year and some months old. They exchanged the battery today in the dealer but even after that the auto start stop failure appeared again with a new battery assembled. My BS 2023 has only 9200 miles, it is in ford dealer right now under investigation of what would be the issue... I dont know what could it be, maybe the starter... lets wait pray and see...

I'm sorry to hear you're having trouble.

I assume the dealer tested the battery health and it's OK.

If the engine starts normally every time when pressing the start/stop button, then the starter; solenoid, start relay, etc. are all good.

No doubt there are many possibilities, but one is that the auto start/stop is not working because the computer thinks the battery is low -- perhaps due to the BMS being faulty, or needing to be reset. See this thread:
https://www.broncosportforum.com/forum/threads/ford-bms-battery-monitoring-system-how-it-works-how-to-properly-charge-how-to-power-accessories.7576/

Post#1 has a good video.

Also, Dude posted this reset procedure in post #12:

Battery Sensor Reset (Battery Management System (BMS) Reset):
When you install a new battery, reset the battery sensor by doing the following:
1. Switch ignition on, and leave the engine off.
Note: Complete Steps 2 & 3 within 10 seconds.
2. Flash the high beam headlamps five times, ending with the high beams off.
3. Press and release the brake pedal 3 times.
The battery warning lamp flashes 3 times to confirm that the reset is successful.

Good luck!

 

[João Leme]

I'm sorry to hear you're having trouble.

I assume the dealer tested the battery health and it's OK.

If the engine starts normally every time when pressing the start/stop button, then the starter; solenoid, start relay, etc. are all good.

No doubt there are many possibilities, but one is that the auto start/stop is not working because the computer thinks the battery is low -- perhaps due to the BMS being faulty, or needing to be reset. See this thread:
https://www.broncosportforum.com/forum/threads/ford-bms-battery-monitoring-system-how-it-works-how-to-properly-charge-how-to-power-accessories.7576/

Post#1 has a good video.

Also, Dude posted this reset procedure in post #12:

Battery Sensor Reset (Battery Management System (BMS) Reset):
When you install a new battery, reset the battery sensor by doing the following:
1. Switch ignition on, and leave the engine off.
Note: Complete Steps 2 & 3 within 10 seconds.
2. Flash the high beam headlamps five times, ending with the high beams off.
3. Press and release the brake pedal 3 times.
The battery warning lamp flashes 3 times to confirm that the reset is successful.

Good luck!

Thanks for the reply. I will exchange some of those ideas with the dealer. The battery assembled right now is a new one so should be all good in it's health... Previous situation was that some times the start was not working at first attempt, but all good in the following starts. An also sometimes start stop activates but engine died after the pause... When I receive some solution from dealer I will let you know thanks!

 

[Bill G]

Okay — battery finally failed!
I’ve had my BSBL since 3/21 with no problems from the original battery. I had the recall performed a couple weeks ago, battery checked okay, and the car performed as well/better after the service.
A couple of days ago I noticed the ASS not kicking in intermittently, so I stopped using it. Yesterday I got the “shutting off systems to preserve battery” messaging for the first time ever, and a little bit of cranking before the engine started. This morning the starter cranked a bit more before the engine fired, and I got some fleeting error messages that disappeared before I could even read them — battery giving up.
Checked on the recommended battery sources; Walmart couldn’t get one to me for (4) days, and the one I wanted was “out of stock”, Costco had none available locally. I didn’t want to start searching, nor did I want to stand in the sun on a 100+ day changing a battery either.
Showed up at my local Ford dealer about 1100. They took me right in and had a new AGM battery installed and me on my way about 1230. Charged me $300 parts/labor/tax, of which I have no complaints (I sat in AC and drank their coffee). My dealer, Puente Hills Ford, saved my butt as I have a doctor appointment tomorrow at 0730, no other ride, and I can’t afford a dead battery.
I didn’t get a “your battery’s going to fail” message on my dash, but there was plenty of warning from my BS if one’s paying any attention; just can’t say if it came from the reprogramming or not.

 

[Dude]

Okay — battery finally failed!
I’ve had my BSBL since 3/21 with no problems from the original battery

Great info!! Thanks!

just curious… was your OE battery the AGM as well?

And have you had the vehicle on a battery maintainer or been driving the vehicle at least for 30 minutes at 30mph or more every couple days and it still failed? (That is, not stop n go)


I just started getting the FordPass App: “Remote features disabled to preserve battery” message, twice in 3 days. I have a plug in voltmeter and i can see the voltage. Today before starting was 11.9V and dropped to 9.8V while starting. I have been driving as i stated earlier. Battery voltage is around 12.6V after driving and within 24 hours (parked) is 11.9 to 12V so is dropping voltage quickly.

 

[sajohnson]

Great info!! Thanks!

btw was your OE battery the AGM as well?
And have you been driving the vehicle at least for 30 minutes at 30mph or more every couple days? (That is, not stop n go)

I just started getting the FordPass App: “Remote features disabled to preserve battery” message, twice in 3 days. I have a plug in voltmeter and i can see the voltage. Today before starting was 11.9V and dropped to 9.8V while starting. I have been driving as i stated earlier. Battery voltage is around 12.6V after driving and within 24 hours (parked) is 11.9 to 12V so is dropping voltage quickly.

It sounds like your battery is definitely on it's way out. Dropping from 12.6V to 11.9V after sitting for just one day is not good. Unless there is a much larger than usual phantom load, that battery could die any day now.

You might consider buying one of those CR top-rated AGM batteries I posted ASAP. IIRC, they were about the same price as the Motorcraft batteries, maybe less. One (the Exide) has a 4 year warranty, the others are 3 years. From what you've said about the heat killing batteries in 18-24 months out there, you can at least get 2 for the price of one.

 

[Dude]

It sounds like your battery is definitely on it's way out. Dropping from 12.6V to 11.9V after sitting for just one day is not good. Unless there is a much larger than usual phantom load, that battery could die any day now.

You might consider buying one of those CR top-rated AGM batteries I posted ASAP. IIRC, they were about the same price as the Motorcraft batteries, maybe less. One (the Exide) has a 4 year warranty, the others are 3 years. From what you've said about the heat killing batteries in 18-24 months out there, you can at least get 2 for the price of one.

Mine is still in warranty so if the mobile service tech tests it as a bad battery it gets replaced for $0. Haven’t had any starting issues yet but likely battery failure is imminent. I have the EFB and I’ll ask for the AGM even if I have to pay more but other owners posted they weren’t allowed to ‘upgrade’ to AGM under the warranty.

if it wasn’t in warranty I would immediately look at the 4 year warranty battery you recommended (see pic, I saved your info - although someone checked recently when I gave them your info and the Exide battery for Bronco Sport was considerable more than $180 where they live).

AAA batteries are also not bad because if it fails in the warranty period it’s like 2 batteries for the price of 1. AAA charges an extra install fee for Bronco Sports. AAA has mobile vans and come to where the vehicle is.

 

[sajohnson]

Mine is still in warranty so if the mobile service tech tests it as a bad battery it gets replaced for $0. Haven’t had any starting issues yet but likely battery failure is imminent. I have the EFB and I’ll ask for the AGM even if I have to pay more but other owners posted they weren’t allowed to ‘upgrade’ to AGM under the warranty.

if it wasn’t in warranty I would immediately look at the 4 year warranty battery you recommended (see pic, I saved your info - although someone checked recently when I gave them your info and the Exide battery for Bronco Sport was considerable more than $180 where they live).

AAA batteries are also not bad because if it fails in the warranty period it’s like 2 batteries for the price of 1. AAA charges an extra install fee for Bronco Sports. They gave mobile vans and come to where the vehicle is.

This may not matter for warranty replacement, but when I checked online pricing for the EFB and AGM -- the AGM was actually LESS.

On the price of the Exide -- I've noticed that unfortunately, when products do well in CR's testing, the mfrs and vendors often jack the price up. At least it sure seems that way. Nothing to be done about that, other than keeping an eye on CR and when you see something you need that tests well -- snap it up before the price increase. Of course that's not likely to happen that often.

I see the other 3 are about $100+ more than the Exide. I'd forgotten that -- I was thinking that all 4 were about $200+/-. The Exide at ~$180 is an easy choice. If the price has increased significantly, then it's a matter of whether it (or the other 3) are still a reasonable value because they will last longer than the Motorcraft.