Well that's it.... We've had it with Ford and this Bronco Sport

[sajohnson]

This is normal behavior by most dealers. Most dealers will allow "original" customers to jump to the head of the line for service appointments. I have no problem with that. Dealers have told me this outright when I have purchased cars. "When you need a repair, we make sure to schedule customers who bought here ahead of those who didn't." They don't refuse to work on other cars, but they give priority to those who also bought their cars there. It makes perfect sense.

It is understandable that a dealership might be inclined to do that, however:

* There are any number of reasons why an owner cannot go back to the dealer that sold them the car. People move, they go on vacation. Cars get sold to buyers i other areas. They should not be treated as second-class customers.

* Perhaps the selling dealer is nearby, but the owner has had bad experiences with them and would like to use another dealer.

* Dealerships make more on service than they do on sales. I believe that they are considered to be 2 separate businesses internally. That's how they should be run. -- service scheduled first-come, first served, without any regard to where the car was purchased.

* Is there any other business that operates the way dealerships currently do? Where my wife and I get eye exams, they also sell gasses and contacts, but all customers are treated exactly the same -- whether they just want an exam, only want contacts, or both. The two businesses are in the same building but they are separate.

Same with consumer products. The owner of an iPhone can take it to any authorized dealer and not be confronted with, "Did you buy it here?!"

Of course there are some decent car dealers, but generally speaking most are out of control and have been for decades.

To end on a positive note -- years ago, I had a coworker who liked to buy performance sedans used, with some factory warranty left. One of them was a BMW M5. It had some warranty issues so he took it to the dealer in Rockville, MD. Keep in mind: a) he did not buy the M5 from them, b) he had never even been there before. The dealer graciously took his car, gave him a brand new BMW loaner, not only fixed all of the problems my coworker pointed out but also found and repaired other issues, and gave the M5 a thorough detailing before returning it! For all they knew they'd never see my coworker again but he still received top-notch treatment.

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[69cuda340s]

So we are to be under the assumption that not only is every Bronco Sport a POS but every Ford is a POS because of your 2 issues?

I think its some sports have problems and large numbers of them are issue free. But majority of dealers have lousy service, not all, but most of them.

My neighbor has a fleet of Fords he knows of one dealer that has good service in my area. The other dozen or so dealers terrible service. One has to ask around find that one that has a good service dept. You can't just willy nilly go to just any Ford dealer the odds are against you getting anything fixed at most of them.

Sounds like original posters sport was bought used so who knows what its history was?

 

[sajohnson]

Beat me to it, re: RV dealerships.

Just had a problem with mine and tried to call the local RV dealer for Winnebago. Had to leave a message; never returned the call.

Then I called the dealership that sold me the RV a few years back (several hundred miles away). Was told I could schedule an appointment for....

...NOVEMBER.

But first I would have to bring it in for a lookover and then take it home until November.






"That is unacceptable..." Remeber, these vehicles are ALWAYS in Beta. Hard to ensure every dealership is keeping up. So maybe, Ford, don't ship so quickly...?

"Otherwise there would be situations...." Why does this sound like Apple's approach...?

"Sell the sizzle..." GREAT line!

Yep, a vehicle owner who wants to feel better about their poor treatment by the dealership only has to go to any RV forum and read the absolute horror stories. It's so bad that a 'lemon law' attorney in Michigan made this video -- and this was several years ago, it's only gotten worse:

"Don't Buy An RV! - Lehto's Law Ep. 45":


A second, more recent one:

"Here is Why You Must be INSANE to buy an RV These Days":


FYI, as you may know, many Winnebago owners have resorted to driving back to the factory in Forest City, Iowa, to get repairs done. We bought our View used, and have had very few problems, but if it ever needs repairs that I can't handle, I'd seriously consider doing that.

Regarding vehicles being sold to the unsuspecting public while in beta mode -- that's another indication of business in general going downhill (like horrible customer service). Nothing wrong with making a profit, but when too much emphasis is placed on the bottom line, quality goes down and owner dissatisfaction goes up.

I'm not an Apple owner (I had an extremely bad experience with Apple years ago) but I used them as an example in my post above, because AFAIK they have a good rep for customer service. You're saying that they have authorized service centers with varying levels of expertise?

To be clear, "Sell the sizzle, not the steak" is a great line, but I can't take credit for it. See:
https://www.close.com/sales/glossary/selling-the-sizzle

 

[kapk22]

It is understandable that a dealership might be inclined to do that, however:

* There are any number of reasons why an owner cannot go back to the dealer that sold them the car. People move, they go on vacation. Cars get sold to buyers i other areas. They should not be treated as second-class customers.

* Perhaps the selling dealer is nearby, but the owner has had bad experiences with them and would like to use another dealer.

* Dealerships make more on service than they do on sales. I believe that they are considered to be 2 separate businesses internally. That's how they should be run. -- service scheduled first-come, first served, without any regard to where the car was purchased.

* Is there any other business that operates the way dealerships currently do? Where my wife and I get eye exams, they also sell gasses and contacts, but all customers are treated exactly the same -- whether they just want an exam, only want contacts, or both. The two businesses are in the same building but they are separate.

Same with consumer products. The owner of an iPhone can take it to any authorized dealer and not be confronted with, "Did you buy it here?!"

Of course there are some decent car dealers, but generally speaking most are out of control and have been for decades.

To end on a positive note -- years ago, I had a coworker who liked to buy performance sedans used, with some factory warranty left. One of them was a BMW M5. It had some warranty issues so he took it to the dealer in Rockville, MD. Keep in mind: a) he did not buy the M5 from them, b) he had never even been there before. The dealer graciously took his car, gave him a brand new BMW loaner, not only fixed all of the problems my coworker pointed out but also found and repaired other issues, and gave the M5 a thorough detailing before returning it! For all they knew they'd never see my coworker again but he still received top-notch treatment.

I received similar customer service from Lexus years ago. I had a vehicle that had went into some kind of theft protect mode and would not recognize the laser cut key. I was the second owner and the car was about 150 miles past the factory warranty. To top it off, the closest Lexus dealership was almost three hours away. They paid for the tow truck to come get it and return it after fixing the problem at no cost.

thank you for the positive story.

on a side note, my boss’s friend just bought a new Raptor and the turn signals don’t work. Apparently Ford told him they can’t fix it until next quarter, so he may have to wait three months to drive his new $175k truck (not sure if it actually cost that much).

 

[gatornek]

on a side note, my boss’s friend just bought a new Raptor and the turn signals don’t work. Apparently Ford told him they can’t fix it until next quarter, so he may have to wait three months to drive his new $175k truck (not sure if it actually cost that much).

Haha. While its a truck for wealthy people only, I think you're friend is embellishing unless he got the gold plated rims option

https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/models/f150-raptor/

 

[kapk22]

Haha. While its a truck for wealthy people only, I think you're friend is embellishing unless he got the gold plated rims option

https://www.ford.com/trucks/f150/models/f150-raptor/

yeah, I thought that sounded a little high. I have no idea what dealerships are marking them up though.

 

[Dude]

Most dealers will allow "original" customers to jump to the head of the line for service appointments. I have no problem with that. Dealers have told me this outright when I have purchased cars. "When you need a repair, we make sure to schedule customers who bought here ahead of those who didn't."

The skeptic in me is would say the dealer says that to make the sale seem better. We all know salespeople will tell you anything to make the sale.

just an opinion and of course could be wrong but it is not good business practice for the reasons sajohnson listed on a prior post.

 

[rneal55555]

By this comment, I can only assume you feel my statement was somehow meant to be derogatory. I'm often surprised by number of persons who find offense in the proper usage of the English language. There was no malice in my statement.

"Your extreme ignorance" kind of sounds derogatory from where I'm sitting, he was obviously unaware with what's involved, you however could have chosen to educate without having to slam him. Using proper English of course.

 

[Sojourner]

FYI, as you may know, many Winnebago owners have resorted to driving back to the factory in Forest City, Iowa, to get repairs done. We bought our View used, and have had very few problems, but if it ever needs repairs that I can't handle, I'd seriously consider doing that.

We may just have to do that. But it's not anything we'd look forward. Long drive from SoMD to start. But once you get there the fun begins. We were in Forest City shortly after we bought the RV to see where it was "born" and to take in the museum, etc. Cool place to visit.

We also wanted to have a small problem looked at (my wife smelled gasoline (I didn't) so to humor her I said sure). First come, first served. The wait time was over a week. Can't stay in the RV, have to find a motel room. Also have to empty it b/c Winnebago assumes no liability (nor should they).

Anyway, we couldn't wait. Long story short, on last day of our round the US trip (as night came on and in a torrential downpour) we lost our rear lights. Nursed it home and then shortly thereafter to the RV dealer (hundreds of miles with no rear lights so my wife drove behind as the "blocker").

Was able to leave the RV for 6 or so weeks. Turns out when Winnebago sat the house of the Class C on the E450 chassis the techs pinched both the rear light wiring AND the gas line. There was a gas leak! What a mess.

So, I agree. One would have to be nuts buying an RV these days. It was always a crap shoot to begin with. One reason we bought Winnebago was that it was supposedly less of a risk. What with Class Cs and Class Bs going for what used to be Class A prices, who in their right mind would take a risk...?

As far as my Apple comment, what I meant was that you must stay in the company's ecosphere for the entirety of your purchase. Some dealerships seem to be saying much the same: you must buy from us if you hope to be serviced by us.

(Apologies to the "stay on topic" police for being off-topic.)

 

[rneal55555]

While I don't like it, it used to be we all went to the dealership to shop, almost always one local to us and they almost all wanted/expected us to become repeat customers. With the internet the world has change we shop for what we want online and go for the best price we can get, dealers are happy to sell us a car online or honor an online price bit the no longer expect us to become repeat customers in fact many don't even try, they just try and pump vehicles through making a $1000 or so on each car. The service end is no longer a way to help make a repeat customer, it truly has become a profit center in it's own rite. warranty work doesn't pay as well as out of warranty work so those repair jobs are much better for the bottom line and the more of those you can turn in a day the better the bottom line is going to be.

It would be interesting to know how many hours Ford pays for the diagnostic on this as a warranty repair, all the manufacturers have been squeezing the dealerships on warranty repairs for a long time.

Anyways I blame the internet it doesn't always make our lives better.

 

[Roadrunner49]

... One of them was a BMW M5. It had some warranty issues so he took it to the dealer in Rockville, MD.... The dealer graciously took his car, gave him a brand new BMW loaner, not only fixed all of the problems my coworker pointed out but also found and repaired other issues, and gave the M5 a thorough detailing before returning it!...

That's why you buy a BMW. From sales to service, they kiss your behind. However, you pay handsomely for the privilege.

 

[sajohnson]

We may just have to do that. But it's not anything we'd look forward. Long drive from SoMD to start. But once you get there the fun begins. We were in Forest City shortly after we bought the RV to see where it was "born" and to take in the museum, etc. Cool place to visit.

We also wanted to have a small problem looked at (my wife smelled gasoline (I didn't) so to humor her I said sure). First come, first served. The wait time was over a week. Can't stay in the RV, have to find a motel room. Also have to empty it b/c Winnebago assumes no liability (nor should they).

Anyway, we couldn't wait. Long story short, on last day of our round the US trip (as night came on and in a torrential downpour) we lost our rear lights. Nursed it home and then shortly thereafter to the RV dealer (hundreds of miles with no rear lights so my wife drove behind as the "blocker").

Was able to leave the RV for 6 or so weeks. Turns out when Winnebago sat the house of the Class C on the E450 chassis the techs pinched both the rear light wiring AND the gas line. There was a gas leak! What a mess.

So, I agree. One would have to be nuts buying an RV these days. It was always a crap shoot to begin with. One reason we bought Winnebago was that it was supposedly less of a risk. What with Class Cs and Class Bs going for what used to be Class A prices, who in their right mind would take a risk...?

As far as my Apple comment, what I meant was that you must stay in the company's ecosphere for the entirety of your purchase. Some dealerships seem to be saying much the same: you must buy from us if you hope to be serviced by us.

(Apologies to the "stay on topic" police for being off-topic.)

I'm very sorry to hear about the problems you had. Your story is very similar to so many others.

Forest City is a long drive, that's for sure. If we were going there I would try to combine it with a road trip (as you did).

This is the first I've heard about owners not being able to stay in their rig (but I haven't been on the RV forums recently). In the past, people said Winnebago had a lot with hookups for customers waiting for service. I wonder what happened?

Regarding the week-long wait, I imagine you were unable to schedule an appointment, but from what I've read, that's what most people do. To be honest, I'm surprised the "walk-in" wait was not more than one week. Personally, I try to avoid reservations/appointments if at all possible. We prefer to play it by ear. That's getting harder to do though.

The 6 weeks you had to wait for the repair is sadly typical. In fact, many owners report waiting months!

On buying new -- the videos aside, many people do buy new, and there are good reasons to do so. I've always purchased cars & trucks new, because I was concerned that a used car might have been abused (I bought performance cars with manual transmissions). We were actually planning on buying a new RV back in 2012, until we realized how expensive they are.

We bought a 2009 View primarily to save money. RVs have always had more problems than a vehicle like the BS, but back then the factory QA was much better, and the dealers were easier to do business with. In short, absolutely no offense was intended (if any was taken) -- my reason for bringing the topic up was to compare RV dealers to auto dealerships.

Finally, I understand what you're saying about the Apple ecosystem. That's definitely a problem (or can be) but it's different from the automobile business in that -- AFAIK -- an Apple customer can go to any Apple "authorized repair and service location." The employees do not care where the customer purchased their iPhone, iPad, etc., but they DO want them to own ALL Apple products, and replace them every 1-2 years. Ford dealers (and others) take it a step further -- it's given that the vehicle is a Ford, the dealers are hyper-focused on whether it was purchased from them.

 

[sajohnson]

That's why you buy a BMW. From sales to service, they kiss your behind. However, you pay handsomely for the privilege.

That's true.

The reason I shared my coworker's experience is that:

* He did not pay much -- <half of the new value.
* He did not buy from the BMW dealer.
* He had no relationship with them, in fact, he'd never been there before.
* That dealership had made $0.00 from him

Even so, they treated him as if he was the CEO of BMW.

Had he bought the M5 there and the dealer made several thousand on the sale, then it would not have surprised me. As it was, from their point of view he was just some rando trying to get free warranty work.

It's too bad that dealers for other auto mfrs cannot treat people the same way -- regardless of where they bought their car.

I really wanted to buy from Granger, but I know from brutal experience how dealers can be, and I did not want any additional hassles.

 

[Bucko]

It is understandable that a dealership might be inclined to do that, however:

* There are any number of reasons why an owner cannot go back to the dealer that sold them the car. People move, they go on vacation. Cars get sold to buyers i other areas. They should not be treated as second-class customers.

* Perhaps the selling dealer is nearby, but the owner has had bad experiences with them and would like to use another dealer.

* Dealerships make more on service than they do on sales. I believe that they are considered to be 2 separate businesses internally. That's how they should be run. -- service scheduled first-come, first served, without any regard to where the car was purchased.

* Is there any other business that operates the way dealerships currently do? Where my wife and I get eye exams, they also sell gasses and contacts, but all customers are treated exactly the same -- whether they just want an exam, only want contacts, or both. The two businesses are in the same building but they are separate.

Same with consumer products. The owner of an iPhone can take it to any authorized dealer and not be confronted with, "Did you buy it here?!"

Of course there are some decent car dealers, but generally speaking most are out of control and have been for decades.

To end on a positive note -- years ago, I had a coworker who liked to buy performance sedans used, with some factory warranty left. One of them was a BMW M5. It had some warranty issues so he took it to the dealer in Rockville, MD. Keep in mind: a) he did not buy the M5 from them, b) he had never even been there before. The dealer graciously took his car, gave him a brand new BMW loaner, not only fixed all of the problems my coworker pointed out but also found and repaired other issues, and gave the M5 a thorough detailing before returning it! For all they knew they'd never see my coworker again but he still received top-notch treatment.

Amen to all these.

 

[Bronchette]

"Extreme ignorance" and proper English just doesn't go as well together as proper manners and the latter.

Bless his heart.

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