Bummer … then will have to use the SYNC4 voice commands or below the bottom of the display glue down a linear strip of dots that indicate function
Sync2 and Sync3 instructions don't work in Carplay or Android Auto, in my experience, in favor of the voice assistants on those experiences.Bummer … then will have to use the SYNC4 voice commands or below the bottom of the display glue down a linear strip of dots that indicate function
Even without that, relying off of voice control for key controls is just poor form. It's like how Tesla thinks gear selection on the Cybertruck should be generally relegated to the touchscreen, as well as the rearview mirror, and on the Model 3, no real speedometer and gauge cluster.
Obviously Ford has not gone that far.
But as someone who experienced controls with no tactility, I think that's a poor human interface consideration for a moving vehicle for frequently used controls. There are people that don't think touchscreens belong at all in cars, I'm far from one of those people. But I have experienced cars that relegate key controls to touchscreen and I think that's a poor/frustrating user experience, but also a dangerous one.
And if Ford wanted to - I think there's no reason they couldn't put real actual button controls for the midyear refresh of the BS.
Other than cost.
Do you know why even if you have a fully trimmed current BS in the current generation, there's a blank piece of plastic to the right of the driver's heated seat?
In the Ford Kuga, that space is occupied by a button for a front windshield with electric resistive defrost element:
Ford chose to essentially reuse the same part but leave a blank piece of plastic that was there to save money. A car where it was impossible to not have a blank button.
Similarly, the touchscreen motivation is not altruistic. If you can stock the same 12" screen regardless of reason, you cut your costs even further... no need for a part where it's manual HVAC, no heated seats, dual automatic HVAC, no heated seats, then dual automatic HVAC, heated seats, no heated steering wheel, and automatic HVAC, heated seats, heated steering wheel. You just control the APIM programming on what APIM buttons display.
This is cheaper for the automaker but horrible from a human interface experience.
Ford learned from this mistake a decade ago and took the Sony Radio faceplate (or FCIM in Ford terms) from the 2015 Fusion with capacitive "buttons" with no tactile feedback:
And made it this in the 2016 Fusion model year, because they learned from user feedback that the 2013-2015 Sony faceplate was awful and saying you could use Sync2/3 voice input did not excuse a lack of tactile buttons:
Time is a flat circle and Ford seems to be hellbent to make the same mistakes again.
Call them "buttons" if you want, but in the human interface of a car, I will distinguish software buttons (screen elements, or non-tactile physical ones) from actual buttons (real tactile feel and an ability to maneuver without driving).
At least Ford has not reached the point of Tesla believing that not having an indicator stalk is a "feature"...
I enjoy my BS and welcome features of the overhaul, I'm going to call out positives like the 360 degree cameras of the facelift. I believe that's huge. Things that make the vehicle more capable offroad, I can quibble about style, but welcome. Sync3 to Sync4, great!
But I'm not going to blindly cheerlead poor human interface decisions of the refresh.
You make a lot of great points, not arguing with any of your points but a few things to consider:
1. It’s not just cost savings to eliminate physical controls - there is also a reliability gain because there are no physical switches or “actual buttons” to break or have their chrome plastic flake off
2. The display screen makes it much easier to change functionality and add capability that’s not possible with physical switches and buttons. Provides for great flexibility.
3. I am able to use both Siri voice control and the Sync3 voice control while CarPlay is not active by using the Voice button on the right side of steering wheel. Unfortunately Ford does not allow the Voice button to access Sync3 voice control while CarPlay is active. I don’t like that inconsistent design.
“Siri activates with a 2 second press of the Voice button. A tap of the button without holding it enables the sync3 voice commands. Both are easily accessible.”
When CarPlay is active, the Voice button is only to access Siri and cannot be used to access Sync3 voice control.
Of course I do like physical switches and actual buttons but I’m used to using screen only controls too.
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Badlands sport has been dinged for lack of front bumper protection and marginal ground clearance since day one. Ford listened paid attention and looks like the '25 is getting front bumper protection and a tad more lift. Will they address the flimsy felt liner on bottom side who knows? Felt wheel well lines will likely stay cause they dampen road noise and are cheap.
I think front rear skid plates, rear tow hooks, tad higher lifts will appeal to buyers. Some may say don't like the looks but I think it will appeal to a lot of buyers.
The bigger touch screen removal of physical burtons knobs I don't care for at all. The current smaller tastefully done center screen in '21-'24s I think was just right. Current radio HVAC button are well done. But industry wide manufacturers think giant computer screens slapped on car dashes sell vehicles so thats the industry trend.
I think front rear skid plates, rear tow hooks, tad higher lifts will appeal to buyers. Some may say don't like the looks but I think it will appeal to a lot of buyers.
The bigger touch screen removal of physical burtons knobs I don't care for at all. The current smaller tastefully done center screen in '21-'24s I think was just right. Current radio HVAC button are well done. But industry wide manufacturers think giant computer screens slapped on car dashes sell vehicles so thats the industry trend.
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I get what you're saying, but I disagree the current HVAC controls are "better" as regards safety. If I want to do anything with the current HVAC controls other than change the temperature I have to look down at the panel to make sure I press the right button. How is the row of dedicated soft buttons on a display any different?
For me at least, I can feel the buttons. If I start from the right temperature knob, I can move my finger from the knob - okay, first button going from the knob right to left, that's the A/C on/off button. I feel the gap between the buttons, okay, I'm at the second button - recirculate cabin air.
Similarly if I want to do the heated seats, first button from either knob on the bottom row. Want to turn off heated steering wheel? Start from the right knob, feel first button, keep moving left, okay I can feel my finger is on the second button, push in and I disable the heated wheel.
Rear defrost is top row first button right of the right knob. Max defrost follows, then regular defrost.
The fan speeds are probably the easiest to find because I just start from the left, feel the blank piece of plastic (which in a Kuga would be an electric resistive front windshield defrost button), and after that I'm at fan speed down. Following button is fan speed up.
I didn't have to mentally memorize with active effort or bruteforce train myself blindfolded testing myself. Eventually just using it enough ,I have muscle memory. I can use the HVAC controls without my eyes ever looking away from the road.
I also *know* when I've pushed a physical button because I can feel the button press inwards.
With the touchscreen controls, all of this is impossible. I can't feel along the bottom of the screen climate controls to know what button I'm on. Firstly the screen provides no tactile feedback, secondly since it's touch sensitive instead of physically pushing in a button, there's no way to touch a touchscreen button without activating it. So you not only have to look at the screen to know what button you're pushing, but you have to glance back to verify that your input registered on the correct button.
Apple thought this was a great idea in the Macbook Pros and put a "touch bar" with the concept that a flexible set of controls that could be tailored specific to the app the user was using was better than F1-F12 keys. Power users hated it because it was impossible to use with muscle memory. It failed to catch on as a result, and Apple eventually relented and put standard keyboard F1-F12 key row instead.
Doing this in a car is even worse because it requires the driver to look away from the road to look at the radio more frequently... as they operate a moving vehicle.
Touchscreens have a ton of use for displays that need to change a lot (like a GPS map), or controls that are not used frequently. Climate controls don't meet this threshold.
Ford had learned this at one point. My 2015 Ford Fusion with Sync2 (MyFord Touch) could only control the heated/cooled seats and heated steering wheel via the touchscreen. The refresh in 2016 put standard real buttons on the FCIM (radio/climate control faceplate) for the heated and cooled seats (as well as the rest of the radio and climate controls - real buttons instead of capacitive touch sensitive buttons jumbled everywhere). I swapped a 2016 faceplate in my 2015 and popped the VIN in via FORScan and it was a much, much better user experience.
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I understand the concept, but there is no way I'm going to Hellen Keller my way around the HVAC control panel when I can simply glance down for a few tenths of a second. I don't consider such a brief glance as dangerous in any way, especially if you are judicious about when you do it. Are you bumper-to-bumper at 70 mph on the interstate with cars on both sides? Maybe not the best time to messing with the HVAC controls, whether you look or just feel.
Again, I see your point, but I believe you can set screen controls to provide audio feedback when they are actuated.
Agree to disagree on this one. Any glance away from the road comes with its own risks.
I think there's a generational gap potentially on this one because I'm a touch typist, so I'm used to very quickly being able to find where I am on controls without looking. I do it unconsciously. I don't have to count "one button, two button, three button", I just think "I want to recirculate the air because a skunk sprayed" and my hand moves.
The problem being that an audio cue just tells you that a button input was registered. Touchscreens being what they are, it doesn't tell you what button on the touchscreen was operated, so then you're looking at the screen to see if your change registered (temperature down one degree turn on/off heated seat, defroster, etc.).
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The same applies to feeling your way; you pressed a button but you may not have pressed the RIGHT button.
Yup.
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Love when these threads take an interesting side trip. I almost bought a '67 in the early 80's when people thought they were kind of old and junky. (at least my crew) The hood weighed a ton. Now that is sheet metal!Looks like this thread on the 2025 BS has morphed into a Mustang thread.
BMW would make that a subscription option but 0.0% of owners would subscribe to it.
Mark, I think the Sync 3 HVAC controls should have been mounted under the screen and the storage bin below. That would have made them easier to look at and control.
I'm for the bigger Sync 4 screen, but not the HVAC touch controls. Curious, if the screen did go blank, will the HVAC controls still be visible.
If there not, that seems to be a safety issue to me. Not being able to defrost the windshield when needed certainly creates problems when driving.
I guess I can learn new things, even at my age, but some of these engineering decisions baffle me.
We can't change them, just adapt.
One would think Ford would be announcing a production date and details on the refresh. It's almost July.
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