Gas mileage??

[thomasm23]

Remember we have the crappy gas here in the Peoples Republic of Ca. Oxygenated gas which makes a difference.

Actually, California has the highest refined fuel from select crude oil to meet air quality standards. The fuel is allowed to have up to 10% Ethanol.

Racing fuel can be over 85% Ethanol. Ethanol is made from corn and is alcohol.

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[FNR8DRZ]

Dealer service department vent.......I had a appointment yesterday at the dealer...well because when I booked the appointment (for an oil change) I was told / denied service to check my fuel economy issues.

When i called it was AI generated. I booked the oil change appointment because it is due soon. I figured that I have an appointment, I will address all my issues. NOPE!

I spoke to a service manager......."how does a customer know that they need to specific with what department to book an appointment with?" I booked an appointment on your stupid AI system....take care of me no matter what my issues are."
I took the day off to get this done and now I have to do it again.

I vented, he apologized, I booked another appointment to get EVERYTHING addressed, and I left pissed off.

I had dealerships!

 

[Stircrazy]

Actually, California has the highest refined fuel from select crude oil to meet air quality standards. The fuel is allowed to have up to 10% Ethanol.

there is a huge difference between e10 and e85. strait gas would be a better option in a daily driven car as ethanol has less energy per gallon and it drops your fuel milage. E10 will drop it between 1 to 3%, E15 to 20 will lower it by about 15 to 20% and E85 will result in a 25% lower fuel economy aproximatly. because it has a higher octain though the mix will allow higher compression ratios which will make up for some of the lost power if tuned corectly. in race engines that run e85 the compression ratios are off throught the roof to a point they wouldn't run on normal pump gas, this, high revs and advanced tuning is how they make more power.

the worst thing about ethanol is it is highly hygroscopic so it adsorbs water rapidy and can cause phase seperation where the ethanol seperates from the gas and sinks to the bottom of the tank. this can cause internal engine corrosion, varnish, deposits and rust in metal fuel tanks. material degradation if they are not selected for the high solvency of ethanol, fuel dilution leading to cylinder wash, and as mentioned lower efficiency due to ethanol having only about 2/3rds the energy of gas.

as for select crude oil how do you figure they bought 12.5% of their imports from Canada last year, there "other" normal supplyers are Brazil, Iraq, Guyana, and Ecuador. so Calli is refining crude from accross the spectrum.

 

[Arcee]

I run only 93 octane in my '25 BB 1.5L. I average 32-35mpg on all highway runs, and 26-28mpg around town.

Hopefully the dealership can run some diagnostics and determine why you are only seeing 18-20mpg. Something definitely does not seem right.

 

[incavulator]

there is a huge difference between e10 and e85. strait gas would be a better option in a daily driven car as ethanol has less energy per gallon and it drops your fuel milage. E10 will drop it between 1 to 3%, E15 to 20 will lower it by about 15 to 20% and E85 will result in a 25% lower fuel economy aproximatly. because it has a higher octain though the mix will allow higher compression ratios which will make up for some of the lost power if tuned corectly. in race engines that run e85 the compression ratios are off throught the roof to a point they wouldn't run on normal pump gas, this, high revs and advanced tuning is how they make more power.

the worst thing about ethanol is it is highly hygroscopic so it adsorbs water rapidy and can cause phase seperation where the ethanol seperates from the gas and sinks to the bottom of the tank. this can cause internal engine corrosion, varnish, deposits and rust in metal fuel tanks. material degradation if they are not selected for the high solvency of ethanol, fuel dilution leading to cylinder wash, and as mentioned lower efficiency due to ethanol having only about 2/3rds the energy of gas.

as for select crude oil how do you figure they bought 12.5% of their imports from Canada last year, there "other" normal supplyers are Brazil, Iraq, Guyana, and Ecuador. so Calli is refining crude from accross the spectrum.

Well said!!! Agree on all points.

My only comment is fuel economy reduction for E85 (as compared to E10) is even worse than you quoted above - on the order of 30.5%. Stoich A/F ratio for E85 is 9.8:1. Stoich for E10 is 14.1:1. If you do the math, you will find there is about a 30.5% decrease from E10 to E85, and about a 33% decrease from E0 to E85 (not that you can find E0 much anymore, unless you want to pay for rec fuel).

I used to work on E85 applications for Ford, and when their corporate pumps were under construction, we had to go buy it publicly for the test vehicles. We were always surprised by the lines at the pumps, because even though E85 was cheaper per gallon, if you compared the difference in cost to the difference in fuel economy, there was NOT a financial benefit to using E85 (i.e. the cost savings was outweighed by the loss in fuel economy).

I even walked up to some people in line on a couple of occasions and asked, "Just out of curiosity, why are you buying E85?" The answer I almost always got was, "It's cheaper." I would then usually follow up with, "Yeah, but have you done the math to see how much fuel economy loss you're seeing?" The typical answer was, "Oh, not in THIS car." As if chemistry and physics don't apply to THAT engine. I just walked away, figuring there is no point trying to explain.

 

[FNR8DRZ]

Well.....I tood the Bronco Sport into the dealer this morning.
And of course....they find nothing wrong.
I have filed a report with Ford, and I am booking another appointment with another dealer to get a 2nd opinion, and if that fails I will take the steps to the buy back program.

This Bronco should be getting at least 22mpg city and 28mpg hwy....that's what the sticker on the window says.
If that's not what its going to give me then they csn take it back.

 

[jkernitzki]

EPA mileage on the Munroney sticker is not a guarantee, promise, or certainty. “Your Mileage May Vary” is not just a slogan, it’s reality. Good luck on a buyback.

 

[Stircrazy]

Well.....I tood the Bronco Sport into the dealer this morning.
And of course....they find nothing wrong.
I have filed a report with Ford, and I am booking another appointment with another dealer to get a 2nd opinion, and if that fails I will take the steps to the buy back program.

This Bronco should be getting at least 22mpg city and 28mpg hwy....that's what the sticker on the window says.
If that's not what its going to give me then they csn take it back.

and remember that is average gas milage on the sticker from the handfull of vehicles they test, and it is just an estimation. you won't get a buy back with that. like I mentioned there are to many varable in city driving to guarentee any milage. how heavy are you on the foot and brake, do you always have the ac cranked and the heated seat on and the radio cranked? the more electrical things you are using the more it affects your milage. is the place where you do most of your city driving very hilly? is there a lot of stop and go traffic I am sure you get the point.

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