Engine RPM’s in Normal Mode

[ZeroCool]

That’s the exact feeling I’m talking about. Like you’ve switched into too high a gear at a certain speed and you get that shudder. I guess what I’m hearing from this thread is this is normal (hence Normal mode lol) for the 1.5l engine. I guess our personal style just prefers Sport mode where you don’t get that feeling. To each their own I suppose. As long as we’re not killing the thing by using Sport mode, I think that’s just what we’ll do. Thanks to all for the help. Much appreciated.

Oh ok nice to now understand exactly what you’re talking about. And I’m just guessing from having owned a ford previously, but I’m wondering if it’s like what some have said in the thread where is just mph optimization. And I’m not a mechanic or a gear head in particular, but the way it makes sense to me is kind of like this. The computer and transmission are constantly trying to be efficient by only putting out as much power as needed. We’re cruising at whatever speed and then hit a slight incline. Now you and I and your wife feel that slight shudder and think hey I need more gas, but the computer either thinks it doesn’t need it, or there’s more of a delay in it kicking up the rpm’s because it’s a computer and it’s allowing more time to optimize fuel economy? I’m not sure. But I think it’s just a less then preferable engine response maybe and not necessarily bad. My Ford Edge would do that and I had a turbo v6 that was 315hp and there was a part of road kind of subtly hilly on the way to and from work where it would always do that too, at one part think because I was just driving along consistently and the transmission just didn’t see a reason to react I guess. And that engine was way more powerful then my 2.0. I am wondering if it happens more often in the 1.5 because I rarely notice it in the 2.0. Honestly today may be the first time because of your post. I can’t recall ever noticing it before. Now watch me notice it now because you pointed it out! Lol.

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[ZeroCool]

Sorry if that was way too much lol

 

[Bigman32hockey]

Lol. I'm sure you're right. It doesn't sound like there is anything wrong with the vehicle. As you said, it's probably just the way they programmed it. And I apologize for pointing this out to you. If you're anything like me, you'll be looking for it all the time now! Hopefully it's less prevalent with the 2.0l. It sounds like that's a better motor overall than the 1.5l

 

[ZeroCool]

Lol. I'm sure you're right. It doesn't sound like there is anything wrong with the vehicle. As you said, it's probably just the way they programmed it. And I apologize for pointing this out to you. If you're anything like me, you'll be looking for it all the time now! Hopefully it's less prevalent with the 2.0l. It sounds like that's a better motor overall than the 1.5l

Your good man that’s why we’re on the forum makes us all feel less crazy I’m about to go to the gas station I’ll see if now the whole car is ruined for me lmfao.
Enjoy that new ride btw! I know you guys are loving it!

 

[christopheru]

That’s the exact feeling I’m talking about. Like you’ve switched into too high a gear at a certain speed and you get that shudder. I guess what I’m hearing from this thread is this is normal (hence Normal mode lol) for the 1.5l engine. I guess our personal style just prefers Sport mode where you don’t get that feeling. To each their own I suppose. As long as we’re not killing the thing by using Sport mode, I think that’s just what we’ll do. Thanks to all for the help. Much appreciated.

That feeling you describe is fairly common with high gear count automatic transmissions from what I understand.
I was commenting to my Ford shop that six better paced gears would be nice on the BS vs the eight we have and they mentioned that the 10 spd transmission in the Ranger is problematic as well.
I am guessing that so many gears are present for fuel economy reasons so that they don’t have to actually make the cars as efficient. It does lead to drivability problems though for people who like the more or less seamless power of old school big engine low gear count auto vehicles (ironically, these people would LOVE an electric car from a drivability perspective since power is all there all the time and delivered instantly). Coming from a lifetime of planning ahead and “instant” power from driving a manual shift, I was pleasantly surprised at how well the auto in the BS works. Do I wish it downshifted better and more aggressively when coasting? Yes. But it is better than most I have driven. Mind you, I pretend it is an old school diesel and drive it accordingly. If I wanted something that handled well or went like stink I would have bought a Golf8 R or a Tesla model 3.

 

[Mark S.]

...they mentioned that the 10 spd transmission in the Ranger is problematic as well.

Can you define "problematic?"

I am guessing that so many gears are present for fuel economy reasons so that they don’t have to actually make the cars as efficient.

The concept of replacing larger, normally aspirated engines with small-displacement, turbocharged engines came out of a desire for efficiency. These engines are as efficient as the manufacturers can make them because that's what government mandates and the market demand. The move toward transmissions with more gears is a direct result of the choice to use smaller engines in the name of efficiency. Smaller engines generally produce less overall torque than larger engines, but the deficiency can be partially made up (in most real-world driving situation) with a smart transmission.

Having more gears more closely spaced together makes it easier to keep engine RPM in the range where the engine produces the most torque. Keeping the engine at peak torque gets the most power for the least fuel, which further improves overall powertrain efficiency. The ultimate expression of this idea is the constantly variable transmission (CVT), which keeps the engine at a constant RPM at or near peak torque as the car accelerates. Torque is the force that provides acceleration, so if you can keep the engine near peak torque you get the best acceleration.

Additionally, lower gearing (such as 1st, 2nd, and 3rd in the Bronco Sport) MULTIPLIES the torque produced by the engine. The lower the gearing the more torque you get at the wheels. That's why your car accelerates much harder in the first few gears, and it's why many hardcore off-road vehicles include a "low" or "granny" gear. You can't go fast in granny gear, but you can easily go up a steep incline because of the massive torque available at the drive wheels. But using short gearing with a six-speed transmission means the engine RPM will be too high at highway speeds. So you add a couple of gears on the top end for highway cruising and you get an eight-speed transmission that provides adequate acceleration for driving around town with low RPM cruising on the highway for the best fuel economy.

Coming from a lifetime of ... “instant” power from driving a manual shift, I was pleasantly surprised at how well the auto in the BS works.

This is the biggest advantage of having a transmission with more gears closely spaced together. Using a transmission with closely spaced gears you can make the most of available torque for better acceleration. In this way, a 3500+ lb car with an engine smaller than Honda uses in its Goldwing motorcycle can drive very similarly to a vehicle with a larger engine that has fewer gears. Yes, the larger engine will provide more overall power if you step on it and wind out the RPMs, but you don't do that very often in everyday driving situations.

I think Ford's approach of using drive modes provides tremendous flexibility. It "tunes" the transmission based on the driver's need/desire: for fuel economy (ECO mode), acceleration performance (SPORT mode), or a balance between the two (NORMAL mode).

 

[Osco]

I’m so glad I grew up with V-8’s.
So glad I know the sound of big displacement.
850 cfm dual pump dual fuel line carbs,
3/4 cams,
Ported and polished heads,
2,500 pound clutches,
Hurst, Edlebrock and 4 into 1 Hooker Headers with the option of running uncapped,
True dual exhaust Twin Glass packs,
Traction bars,
Trunks big enough to sneak six or seven drunk friends into the drive in movies,
Air shocks out back to hide the load.
Our drive modes were directly dependent on three things:
How many Cubic Inches our engines had.
How big our balls were,
And how drunk we were,

 

[christopheru]

Can you define "problematic?"


The concept of replacing larger, normally aspirated engines with small-displacement, turbocharged engines came out of a desire for efficiency. These engines are as efficient as the manufacturers can make them because that's what government mandates and the market demand. The move toward transmissions with more gears is a direct result of the choice to use smaller engines in the name of efficiency. Smaller engines generally produce less overall torque than larger engines, but the deficiency can be partially made up (in most real-world driving situation) with a smart transmission.

Having more gears more closely spaced together makes it easier to keep engine RPM in the range where the engine produces the most torque. Keeping the engine at peak torque gets the most power for the least fuel, which further improves overall powertrain efficiency. The ultimate expression of this idea is the constantly variable transmission (CVT), which keeps the engine at a constant RPM at or near peak torque as the car accelerates. Torque is the force that provides acceleration, so if you can keep the engine near peak torque you get the best acceleration.

Additionally, lower gearing (such as 1st, 2nd, and 3rd in the Bronco Sport) MULTIPLIES the torque produced by the engine. The lower the gearing the more torque you get at the wheels. That's why your car accelerates much harder in the first few gears, and it's why many hardcore off-road vehicles include a "low" or "granny" gear. You can't go fast in granny gear, but you can easily go up a steep incline because of the massive torque available at the drive wheels. But using short gearing with a six-speed transmission means the engine RPM will be too high at highway speeds. So you add a couple of gears on the top end for highway cruising and you get an eight-speed transmission that provides adequate acceleration for driving around town with low RPM cruising on the highway for the best fuel economy.


This is the biggest advantage of having a transmission with more gears closely spaced together. Using a transmission with closely spaced gears you can make the most of available torque for better acceleration. In this way, a 3500+ lb car with an engine smaller than Honda uses in its Goldwing motorcycle can drive very similarly to a vehicle with a larger engine that has fewer gears. Yes, the larger engine will provide more overall power if you step on it and wind out the RPMs, but you don't do that very often in everyday driving situations.

I think Ford's approach of using drive modes provides tremendous flexibility. It "tunes" the transmission based on the driver's need/desire: for fuel economy (ECO mode), acceleration performance (SPORT mode), or a balance between the two (NORMAL mode).

Nope. I cannot define problematic.


I think though that the best balance of any engine I have driven is the 1.8l turbo in the Golf 7. It has almost the same torque as the 1.5l ecoboost in the bronco sport, but at 1600rpm. That made it a very responsive vehicle to drive. The vehicle was also significantly more fuel efficient even when pounded on, but that had more to do with the shape of the thing than anything else - the bronco sport is a brick.

 

[Mark S.]

...the bronco sport is a brick.

Yes, but a rather cute one!

 

[christopheru]

Yes, but a rather cute one!

So true!

 

[dejones64]

That’s the exact feeling I’m talking about. Like you’ve switched into too high a gear at a certain speed and you get that shudder. I guess what I’m hearing from this thread is this is normal (hence Normal mode lol) for the 1.5l engine. I guess our personal style just prefers Sport mode where you don’t get that feeling. To each their own I suppose. As long as we’re not killing the thing by using Sport mode, I think that’s just what we’ll do. Thanks to all for the help. Much appreciated.

I too have felt this "shudder". I'm at 6700 miles. For the last couple hundred miles the shudder seems to have subsided or gone away (normal and eco mode). Does the BS have the adaptive learning transmission, to smooth out this shudder?

 

[Glamdring70]

I don’t know if it’s a fluke, or because I mine was an order someone abandoned, but I don’t notice the fake engine noise on sport mode. Is there something you have to do to hear it?

I think it is mostly when you hit the gas. The extra idle generates some extra noise right that way. Here's an old review video that demonstrates it:


This whole video is a really fair review in my opinion if you want to check it out but it is a long video.

 

[ZeroCool]

I think it is mostly when you hit the gas. The extra idle generates some extra noise right that way. Here's an old review video that demonstrates it:


This whole video is a really fair review in my opinion if you want to check it out but it is a long video.

I guess I’m not flooring it enough? Lol I dunno man mine doesn’t sound like that. Maybe I’ll post something.

 

[Mark S.]

I guess I’m not flooring it enough? Lol I dunno man mine doesn’t sound like that. Maybe I’ll post something.

For the EcoBoost Mustang Ford calls this "engine sound enhancement," or ESE. The system was tied in with the ambient noise cancellation system, and I could not find a way to disable one without disabling both. If the system in the Bronco Sport is like the Mustang, the piped-in engine noise gets louder as RPM increases. It's really subtle at lower RPMs.

There was a great deal of discussion about ESE on the EcoBoost Mustang forums, mainly about how to disable it. A lot of people derided it as trying to make a four-banger sound like a V8. According to Dave Pericak, the lead engineer on the S550 Mustang team, the sound was not meant to replicate V8 noises. It was, he claimed, recorded and amplified sounds from the 2.3L engine. EcoBoost engines are designed with the exhaust manifold integrated with the head to minimize the distance between the cylinder exhaust ports and the turbocharger. This allows more rapid spooling of the turbine, keeping turbo lag to a minimum. Unfortunately, it makes it very difficult to get a decent sounding exhaust note. For as long as I was in the Mustang community I never heard an aftermarket exhaust system that I liked enough to spend money on. In later years Ford began offering a factory system with servo-controlled valves in the exhaust system so you could select different exhaust notes. Those were far better sounding to me than anything available from the aftermarket.

The video below shows what comes through the speakers at different RPMs on the EcoBoost Mustang.

 

[ZeroCool]

I guess I’m not flooring it enough? Lol I dunno man mine doesn’t sound like that. Maybe I’ll post something.

Tried again. My cab engine noise is not that deep sounding. ?‍ I don’t think mine has any added sound.

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