Brakes after TSB

[BayBrownBronco]

I did some more research into this. For my Ford, this only causes trouble when I wash it then park it in my garage overnight - then back it out the next day. (Although: a few times I'd notice it on rainy days, if I run an errand and then park it, then back out again later in the day). For my situation: IF, I could solve the problem on days I wash the car, I'd consider it pretty much solved and would not pursue getting better brake pads. I rarely drive somewhere on rainy days and then back out the next day, since I can choose which days I drive into work and only do so 3-4 days per week. Lately, I've also started backing into my garage to park... precludes the trouble entirely... and is actually not that hard thanks to the backup camera. That also makes leaving for work a cinch in the mornings.

Anyway, I now suspect the core issue is not caliper pins/bushings so much as it is light surface rust forming overnight on the rotors, after a car wash or rain. I found an article and product I'm going to try out, then will update folks here. The stuff's out there on EBay, it's not cheap... but it's sure cheaper than new pads. In the meantime, whenever I wash the car, I'm going to run it up and down the driveway a couple times to really dry out the rotors before parking for the night. Article link:

https://www.obsessedgarage.com/blogs/og-knowledge-base/rust-on-rotors

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[Ford Motor Company]

RiotfunK, thanks for posting. My BS BL has 14k miles and started making the moan in reverse at about 10k. Busy with work, I couldn't get in to have the TSB done til last week. They replaced my faulty 12v battery, re-flashed the APIM since the head unit often blacked out while driving, and did two TSB repairs on the brakes (new front rotors, and the bushings for the rear brakes). I noticed yesterday after washing it, the moan still happens. (It has always been at its worst, summer or winter, after washing the car and getting the brakes wet). Also: I never use the Auto Hold function, so that's not a factor. Guess I will have to go back again to the dealer... though thanks to your post, I'm going to test out the brakes on a wet or gravel road first. For those who eventually decided to get their own parts to solve this - was it solvable with just getting new pads? If so, what pads or pad types are best for stopping the noise? I don't care about brake dust, so maybe that widens my choices some. Also: I never use the Auto Hold function, so that's not a factor.

Hi there! Will you send us a message with your VIN and your local Ford dealer? I can look into things on my end.

 

[RiotfunK]

I don’t even have 10k on the fronts and the rears were replaced maybe 1500 miles ago. I’ve posted a video on another thread about the noise.

And it has nothing to do with surface rust

 

[69cuda340s]

I did some more research into this. For my Ford, this only causes trouble when I wash it then park it in my garage overnight - then back it out the next day. (Although: a few times I'd notice it on rainy days, if I run an errand and then park it, then back out again later in the day). For my situation: IF, I could solve the problem on days I wash the car, I'd consider it pretty much solved and would not pursue getting better brake pads. I rarely drive somewhere on rainy days and then back out the next day, since I can choose which days I drive into work and only do so 3-4 days per week. Lately, I've also started backing into my garage to park... precludes the trouble entirely... and is actually not that hard thanks to the backup camera. That also makes leaving for work a cinch in the mornings.

Anyway, I now suspect the core issue is not caliper pins/bushings so much as it is light surface rust forming overnight on the rotors, after a car wash or rain. I found an article and product I'm going to try out, then will update folks here. The stuff's out there on EBay, it's not cheap... but it's sure cheaper than new pads. In the meantime, whenever I wash the car, I'm going to run it up and down the driveway a couple times to really dry out the rotors before parking for the night. Article link:

https://www.obsessedgarage.com/blogs/og-knowledge-base/rust-on-rotors

If you have a Leaf Blower on hand you can blow air through the wheel get some of the water off the brakes after washing. I leaf blow after wash get water out of creases around lights door handles ect and gives a jump start to drying.

 

[Quadcrazy]

Hi there! Will you send us a message with your VIN and your local Ford dealer? I can look into things on my end.

I am having the same problem on our 2023 BS Big Bend. Can we send you our VIN to see if a TSB is out on our vehicle?

 

[BayBrownBronco]

Hi there! Will you send us a message with your VIN and your local Ford dealer? I can look into things on my end.

Hi Ford! I've seen you post on this site, offering to help other BS owners - and that's a great thing! It's a great comfort, to know there's another avenue if needed, for getting immediate help.

For now though, I'm going to take a "rain check" (no pun intended) on this. I spoke with my dealer today, a Service Mgr whom I trust there, and what he told me did match up with the research I've done on the web. To whit, that this moaning brakes issue is a common one and is not peculiar to Fords nor to the Bronco Sport. The TSB repair they do for the issue has limited chances of completely solving the issue. He said the core problem is the materials now in use on brake rotors on many makes/models out there. It lends itself to this resonant harmonic vibration, at low speeds, in reverse, especially when the rotors and pads are cold and/or wet. (BTW - like RiotfunK said - it's likely not a rust issue).

I've not given my new front rotors the needed couple-hundred miles yet, before really hammering my brakes to test the possible weakness issue RiotfunK mentioned. However I did drive my BS to work today, a round trip of ~20 miles, on dry roads at regular highway speeds... and the brakes seem normal and plenty strong so far. Once I have a few more miles and can really slam the brakes in a wet parking lot, I will update the tribe here.

Also - I'm revising my car washing plan to include the Hyde's Rustopper spray once I get it (its coming now, from my EBay buy) - and to try out using my leafblower to dry the car and brakes some (per 69cuda's idea - thanks!). Finally, I've switched around to always backing into my garage. No more backing out early in the morning before the coffee kicks in

 

[incogneato]

I wish I’d seen this thread 4 days ago! A ‘21 BS BL came home with me Saturday night... No issue during the test drives, but it had been unseasonably warm and a unusually dry last week. A front came through overnight, bringing heavy rain and a major temperature drop.

Sunday I went out to drive it, and noticed a low-moan when applying brakes going forward, but braking in reverse sounded like whales mating! Additionally, after letting off the brakes while backing, there was a subdued moan, which makes me wonder if a caliper wasn’t fully releasing.Unfortunately, it was at this point that I ran across the multiple online posts about the issue.

Monday morning, I called the Service Dept. where I bought it, explained the situation, and asked if they could verify if they had the TSB-related parts available, as I wanted to schedule a time to bring it when I could wait on it, being an hour (one way) from them. They explained that in order to confirm the problem and correctly repair it, they would need it for 2-4+ days. I told them I’d need time to figure out how I could do that, and would call them back.

Interestingly, I drove it again a few hours later, and there was not a hint of a problem. Although still cold, it had warmed a few degrees, and had not rained in >24 hours, giving me time to focus on the things that led me to trade for it.

I do wish that Ford would come up with a uniform resolution for ANY Bronco Sport with this issue (my VIN shows “zero” recalls/TSBs) that facilitated being able to correct it while waiting on it, even if a full day. Time will tell…

 

[Mark S.]

Interestingly, I drove it again a few hours later, and there was not a hint of a problem. Although still cold, it had warmed a few degrees, and had not rained in >24 hours, giving me time to focus on the things that led me to trade for it.

This is the problem. It's both intermittent (on cars that experience the problem) and not all owners report the symptoms. To find a solution the technician needs access to a vehicle experiencing the issue, under the conditions which cause it, at the time that its occurring. And they only get one chance at identifying the issue, because as soon as the brakes warm up the issue is gone. AAAAAAND, whatever solution they come up with that just happens to work for one vehicle may not work for the next.

Imagine being a shop supervisor dealing with customers who (understandably) demand someone fix their car. I would not like to be that person...

 

[incogneato]

This is the problem. It's both intermittent (on cars that experience the problem) and not all owners report the symptoms. To find a solution the technician needs access to a vehicle experiencing the issue, under the conditions which cause it, at the time that its occurring. And they only get one chance at identifying the issue, because as soon as the brakes warm up the issue is gone. AAAAAAND, whatever solution they come up with that just happens to work for one vehicle may not work for the next.

Imagine being a shop supervisor dealing with customers who (understandably) demand someone fix their car. I would not like to be that person...

Valid points, and a great reminder for me to proofread from an “eyes of others” perspective before posting. For starters, I need to refrain from using “I wish”, as anyone who doesn’t know me well won’t understand that I use that “tongue-in-cheek” to precede what I know isn’t realistic and/or over-simplified, whereas if I’m attempting a useful recommendation, it will involve numbers and/or bullet-points.

Likewise (understandably) unclear is that I do realize the complexity of the situation and have empathy for Ford & the dealerships. In my case, from the time this vehicle was traded through delivery to me (3-4 days total), I know weather conditions weren’t favorable for causing the issue. Additionally, I appreciate that dealership was up-front about wanting to take time to “get right” in diagnosing & addressing the issue.

OTOH, perhaps an “once of prevention” measure would be to pay additional attention to the brakes when servicing/inspecting BSs after 10k miles? The listing for one did have a pre-cleanup photo showing significant brake dust build-up on the front wheels, and a service record (at that dealership) from 6 months/3k miles ago that included “brakes checked”; both of which might be “normal”, but (of course) stand out after you’ve experienced the issue.

Thanks again for the response.

 

[Mark S.]

I need to refrain from using “I wish”,

You probably read far more into my post that was meant. I wasn't making a judgement about you personally, it was more of a generalized lament about the current mess as it is. Owners have every right to demand a fix for a vehicle they paid goog money for. And I agree with you that the TSB should have been accomplished prior to the dealership (assuming it's a Ford establishment) putting the car up for sale. Then again, if the previous owner didn't complain about it the best course of action (when it comes to maintenance) is to leave it alone if it's working properly.

At any rate, I hope Ford is able to find a satisfactory resolution for everyone.

 

[incogneato]

You probably read far more into my post that was meant. I wasn't making a judgement about you personally...

Not at all! Your post wwas spot-on, and the thought of taking it personally never entered my mind. That comment wasn't a snipe at you, it was me "thinking out loud". Welcome to "trying to communicate with an INTP", where everything is over-analyzed, and our efforts to clarify tend to create more confusion .

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